Comparing quiet pac mufflers

[dirtkeeper]

Just want to share some pics and observations on a few different quiet pack mufflers.

I would really like to find a high quality quiet pack muffler. In the beginning of history , about 40 years ago, I had a thunder bird quiet pack exhaust. I got about 60k miles out of it and during that time I smashed it, bent it crushed It in all manners and ultimately it got dragged out behind me so it was sticking straight out the rear like a stinger would. Damn thing still was solid non leaking when I finally removed it. Since that time I barely get 10k miles out of a muffler.

I have a class 11 style lifted bug and. I am keen to get us much clearance from the ground as I can.Because I have a a “thing” header and modified (cut and bent) rear apron etc. I have the muffler custom installed to fit my stuff. My only requirement is that the quiet pack “size” and shape is the best for the tightest fit. The Mondo mufflers , fat boys and others are just too big to fit tight in my situation. I have considered putting the muffler under the fender but still would need the quiet pack size form factor. I would consider a muffler from another vehicle if it has similar size, if any one has suggestions.

Anyway it’s time to change my exhaust again and I picked up an empi quiet pac. After getting it and being refreshed in how crappy they are I hesitated. I decided to try the tri mill exhaust, so I purchased one of those. I plan to have it installed soon. It is smaller than the others so am concerned it’s going to be louder. I do prefer the quietest exhaust I can get and I am not that concerned with performance, I have a mild 2050 that seems to run well.

So here are some pictures and observations about these three mufflers

The empi: these have what appear to be factory machine welds, in that the welds look perfectly done. These mufflers are crap because the outer skin is wrapped and have a few tack weld holding the flap together. An odd thing is I have an older empi muffler that has the inlet going into the inside side of the muffler and the output on the outside edge . The current ones have it opposite with the inlet going to the outer edge and the outlet coming from the inner edge. In the older one I mention the turn is pretty sharp and the pipe bend is not round, kind of oval ish over bent. Not sure why the one I had was different or if this is just random.

The bugpack: this is much better than the empi. Mostly because it has a folded bead that the muffler seals together instead of a tack welded flap. Also the mount was attached to the bead which is stronger than the mount welded to the flat sheet metal. I got about 10K miles out of my current one but you can see from the pictures that the sheetmetal across the center has cracked, and I have put some clamps , a piece of exhaust wrap and a metal cover to squeak out another few miles. It was pretty quiet.

The Tri MIll: this one seems we’ll built, it has bead holding the muffler together , appears to be human welded in that the welds are good but not a perfect bead like the empi. Also they put a little weld on the outer edges off the bead which I imagine helps. It is considerably smaller so I assume it may be louder or maybe not breath as well. We shall see.

The empi and the tri Mill have the strap mount welded onto the sheet metal of the muffler, which seem stupid. I know that several of my mufflers have started to rip from there as the vibration just tears that weak connection apart. When I have my mufflers installed I have them relocate the mount to a new bracket that is connected to the strong corners, the bead, or a metal cross bar so that it does not rely on the crappy sheetmetal.

Ok here. Are the pics.

The three different mufflers, notice the tri Mill is about 5 “ shorter, other than that they are all the same size.

This shows the bead on the tri Mill and the crappy flap tac weld on the empi

This is my current patched and strapped muffler trying to get a few more miles

This shows the weld at the edges of the bead on the tri Mill

The bug pack has a nice rear bead holding the skin together but doesn’t have the end welds I found on the tri Mill

One of my empi mufflers literally fell off.

Here is the one empi I got years ago that had the inlet and outlet reversed of what I normally see

Here is an empi blown apart at the seam

[Frank Bassman]

I too have an old bugpack and it is doing fine, but I feel like it has become very loud, almost like my old glasspack. How do you feel the tri mil compares to the bugpack in loudness? I'm looking for a good quality quietpack but I am NOT throwing money away on an empi if it's going to blow apart like that.... The quality of the can is appaling. Their glasspack is good though.

-Frank

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[Ebel]

You might try going to a muffler place. Think they used to be called Midas by me. Can’t remember seeing one for a while though. They may be able to pick one out if you bring in an old one. I don’t know about their performance or quality. But I’d think it would be better then that empi one. Some parts stores used to have a pretty good stock of mufflers too. If you had one with a good employee you might be able to bring the old one in and they could match it. I can’t believe the seam on that empi muffler though.

[jismay]

Summitracing.com lists over 9000 items when you filter for mufflers. There has to be something there that will fit your application. Installation will certainly require a good muffler shop or fabrication skills, but nothing too hard.

As nice as it can be to stick with "vw" suppliers there are lots of parts out there from non-vw sources that will work fine with a little old school hot-rod mindset.
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1970 Squareback with 1915cc dual 40idf
1979 Beetle Convertible
1980 Vanagon Westfalia
1989 VW Cabriolet

[modok]

i have not seen any off the shelf muffler sized just right to replace the old QP.
Certainly even less-so today.
Although I think there are companies that would be happy to make them for you if you meet a minimum order.

[scubaseas]

CSP has a nice albeit expensive 1.4301 stainless one that is well made and might work for you.


https://www.csp-shop.com/en/exhaust-heating/universal-muffler-csp-251-010-50420l-24570a.html
_________________
Al

08/1970 T2a Westphalia owned since 1980

ASE Master certification. 50 years pushing a wrench
Retired

[67rustavenger]

OP, With what you have invested in those three systems and mufflers. That have, rusted or blown out.

You could have one of these.

The last header, heat exchanger, muffler system you'll ever buy!
CSP EVO SS.
_________________
I have learned over the years.
Cheap parts are gonna disappoint you.
Buy Once, Cry Once!

There's never enough time to do it right the first time. But there's always enough time to do it thrice.
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo!

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[stevemariott]

Nice observations of the QP mufflers.

Probably 25 years ago I put my first set of Bugpack Dual QPs on my bus, I liked them. They lasted about 4 years until one of them tore in half, similar to your current muffler.

I tried to replace the muffler itself with an Empi single QP, but it was angled differently or something, so I ended up replacing the whole setup with an Empi. It was kind of junky, as I recall, but it lasted a few years.

The last setup I put on it was a Thunderbird I bought from CB around 2004, and it didn't fit well so I had a muffler shop put on a universal muffler of some sort, which was the right size for a VW QP.

My buggy has a Tri-Mil single QP, I'm not sure if it's the same exact muffler you have but it has the same bead on it. It's pretty quiet, not obnoxious, I like it. The Tri-Mil systems seem to be good quality.

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[Rome]

I remember the HotVWs article from the early 1970's when Gene Berg experimented with a single QP muffler to pursue a quieter muffler than the then-prevalent glass pack. He sourced one from a Jeep, army surplus I think. He may have needed to weld on the inlet and outlet elbows and certainly the 3-bolt mounting flange. Maybe the vintage Jeep world would be another possibility for a raw unit.

And I'm nearly certain that one of the major US suppliers sells a stainless steel single QP. But as mentioned already, there are minor variations in the angle of the mounting flange among the system manufacturers.

[rcooled]

Thinking that I could get a bit more ground clearance and have the muffler tucked up closer under my Ghia's rear apron, I tried an EMPI single quiet-pack mated to a 'Hi-Mount' header from Aircooled.net. Despite being told that this combo would do what I wanted, it did just the opposite. The whole thing looked like crap.

Just wanted to warn folks not to go this route if they're looking for more ground clearance with a quiet-pack system.

_________________
'63 Ragtop (current)
'65 Ghia coupe (totaled)
'67 Ghia convertible (current)
'69.5 Ghia convertible and
'62, '63, '65, '69 Bugs (all long gone)